Need AD&D 1E Advice

[Bob Schroeck]

Hopefully someone can point out something I've overlooked.

I need a way to knock out a mixed (human, elf, half-elf, half-orc, gnome) party of about 8 characters (and their horses), most of which are around level 10.  Since AD&D1 Sleep doesn't affect creatures over 4 HD, that's out.  It needs to be silent-ish, not cause physical damage, ignore elf Sleep resistance and saving throws -- or be stackable so multiple instances can be applied to make sure everyone's out.  It also needs to last at least 10 or 20 minutes, and the victims have to be so out cold that people walking among them -- and kidnapping one! -- won't wake them.

I don't want to handwave this.  Although I can resort to an original aerosol drug of some sort, I would rather be able to point at an obscure spell or magic item.

Can anyone help?

[classicdrogn]

Drow knockout poison was nasty stuff, but I don't remember if it was actually in 1e or if it was introduced in 2nd, plus there's always the question of what a Drow was doing working with your presumably non-Drow, non-Underdark antagonists. If you can come up with an interesting reason for that which fits with and adds to the rest of your plot, I'd say go for it, but not if it's going to just add an unnecessary distraction or wallbanger moment.

[Bob Schroeck]

Mm. Interesting idea. I'll have to look into it -- thanks!

[Epsilon]

Carving of Restful Sleep: Once hung on a wall everyone in the room falls asleep instantly. No save. Explicitly effects elves and other demihumans resistant to sleep. (Assualt on Raven's Ruin)

[Bob Schroeck]

Ooh, that would work... if I could figure out how to get it inside a Leomund's Secure Shelter... And if I could get it inside, I probably wouldn't need it, dammit.

I'm thinking an aerosolized "clone" of the drow poison at the moment. It's really more of a plot device, but I want my bases covered -- and it will also let me give tantalizing clues to the party: faint, slightly sticky residue on everything; headaches on waking; maybe some unexpected effect on the horses...

[Epsilon]

Ultimately I suggest this:

"Hey guys, for tonight's adventure I need you all to be put to sleep with no save or resistance. If you agree to let it happen, I will say it will make a better session in my opinion. Any objections?"

Screwing over players who invested in defenses against a thing by pointing to an obscure rule or handwave or broken magic item is basically just being an asshole. If the players would object... then don't do it. Either let the dice fall where they may or just discard the plotline. A good game trumps any mechanical concerns and good games are built on trust and openness.

[Bob Schroeck]

Well... this isn't a pickup group of teenagers -- my players have been in this campaign for almost thirty years. (Well, except for Nina, who's only 19, and Tiffany, who's both a new player and in her 20s.) They trust me, and I'm worthy of their trust. They know that I'm not going to screw them over, and they won't react to the party getting knocked out as me being an asshole to them. They're also very used to reality trumping what the rules say when it makes for a better adventure. They'll know it's part of a bigger story where they will eventually get to kick epic ass, and they aren't so immature as to throw a fit because someone found a hole in their defenses.

(And it is a hole, literally -- Leomund's Secure Shelter, which they've used on overland travels for 25 years or more of playing, isn't air-tight. I've unintentionally given them a couple hints along those lines in the last few sessions, with their horses smelling a dragon, and griffons smelling them, and it's about time a clever opponent used it against them. Which is why I've decided that I will be going with the aerosolized knock-out drug.)

Plus, approaching them like that breaks immersion, as well as acts as a spoiler. They'd rather have the surprise and the drama.

[classicdrogn]

I congratulate you on your ability to find and retain good players. If I'd been able to find such a group, I might have played more actual games rather than just collecting the books/ebooks.

(Though with how I eventually flaked out on Ethan's game, maybe not too... but face to face is different than play-by-post, and the stabilizing influence of actual personal interaction is no small part of that.)

[Bob Schroeck]

I'm particularly happy that my game is so well-loved by my players that it's picked up a second-generation player. Nina's overheard game sessions for a fair chunk of her life, save for the several-year hiatus we were on when everyone moved too far away (West Virginia, California, deepindaharta Pennsylvania) for regular sessions, and has heard the "no shit, there I was" stories for all of her life. When I could restart the campaign, she practically begged to be allowed in.