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2020, the election campaigns have begun
2020, the election campaigns have begun
#1
As above, we all know they have started, Elizabeth Warren, Kirsten Jillibrand, (sp?) and others. I know you guys are dems and it is going to be a big field for you, but lets see if an independent can get a more centrist view maybe.

Then again, he could just fuck your side over like Ross Perot did HW's reelection chances.

https://townhall.com/tipsheet/mattvespa/...t-n2540559
Wolf wins every fight but the one where he dies, fangs locked around the throat of his opponent. 
Currently writing BROBd

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RE: 2020, the election campaigns have begun
#2
An actual moderate in the race would have my vote in an instant - without one, I'll probably stick with throwing it away on the Libertarians in a futile, idealistic attempt to make any third party at all relevant since you could barely get a Republican elected dog catcher in my area let alone to a national office.
--
‎noli esse culus
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RE: 2020, the election campaigns have begun
#3
Just FYI, Howard Schultz is way out of his depth and is not going to be a factor in 2020. So far his only articulated positions are that he doesn't like Trump, and that he thinks that taxing billionaires more is a bad idea. The first is not close to a unique position, and the second will only mobilize the top 1% to the polls, as Bernie would say.

Kirsten Gillibrand is the centrist in the race so far, with her A rating from the NRA, and her call to make English the official language of the United States.

Tulsi Gabbard is next in the conservative Democrat side, having worked in her family's gay conversion clinic for a few years. If you're saying "Tulsa who?" you've got a lot of company. Except she's also a Berniecrat. As her campaign is already faltering, I don't expect her to be a factor.

Elizabeth Warren already has a clear message. Kamala Harris has experience in bare-knuckle politics. Joe Biden has a lot of built-in support if he decides to run, as does Bernie Sanders. These are the likely frontrunners.

Cory Booker hasn't announced yet, but you know he wants it.

Michael Bloomberg is the only billionaire candidate I'd take seriously. At the same time, is having one billionaire face another one in the general election the message that Democrats want to send? I really don't think so.

Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez is not running for president, and I consider her a liberal equivalent to the more annoying conservatives -- a sideshow that can safely be ignored.
--∇×v⃑
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RE: 2020, the election campaigns have begun
#4
Bah, centrist views?

The USA political field is a bunch of right leaning to flat out far right people.
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RE: 2020, the election campaigns have begun
#5
(01-31-2019, 04:08 PM)Labster Wrote: ...
Kirsten Gillibrand is the centrist in the race so far, with her A rating from the NRA, and her call to make English the official language of the United States.
...

That's centrist on your side of the border? Up here, that's so right-wing you'd have trouble getting nominated.

(It's no secret that the right goes to Washington and the left goes to Hollywood.)
--
Rob Kelk

"Governments have no right to question the loyalty of those who oppose them. Adversaries remain citizens of the same state, common subjects of the same sovereign, servants of the same law."
- Michael Ignatieff, addressing Stanford University in 2012


"Dont let anyone think for you; most people can barely think for themselves."
-
Rare Earth, "The Giants You Can't See from the Ground"
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RE: 2020, the election campaigns have begun
#6
Really that was her 10 years ago when she represented a conservative upstate New York district. Gillibrand had a change of heart and admitted she was wrong about guns about the time she ran for statewide office. Which I can't say that I'm against pragmatism to win elections, but really why can't they just say that they were trying to represent their districts at the time? This is in contrast to Elizabeth Warren whose whole career has centered around the same topics. Sorry, but as a Democrat, I'm contractually obligated to engage in friendly fire. It's just what we do.

Earlier I didn't mention Governor Jay Inslee of Washington. He's looking to make climate change the center of his campaign, along with the usual argument of actual executive experience.

There are people out there trying to get Beto O'Rourke to run, despite the fact that he couldn't defeat the U.S. Senate's most hated member, Ted Cruz of Texas. He's a good, aspirational speaker with the ability to connect to a lot of people, but his resume is a little thin at this point.

The strongest person out there who is not going to run is Jerry Brown, who is even more of a climate hawk. He hasn't run for President since 1992 (and think how much trouble that would have saved us?), but he's getting kind of old. Still, after 8 more years in the governor's office, he turned a debt into a surplus with a huge reserve fund ("rainy-day fund").
--∇×v⃑
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RE: 2020, the election campaigns have begun
#7
To the surprise of nobody, Bernie Sanders has tossed his hat into the ring.

Not a moderate.
--
Rob Kelk

"Governments have no right to question the loyalty of those who oppose them. Adversaries remain citizens of the same state, common subjects of the same sovereign, servants of the same law."
- Michael Ignatieff, addressing Stanford University in 2012


"Dont let anyone think for you; most people can barely think for themselves."
-
Rare Earth, "The Giants You Can't See from the Ground"
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RE: 2020, the election campaigns have begun
#8
God dammit Burnie, this again? Didn't you do enough damage last time?
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RE: 2020, the election campaigns have begun
#9
The only reason damage was suffered was because the bigwigs among the Democrats wanted Hillary, which was a huge mistake on their part. Otherwise, I think Bernie might have defeated Trump.
Yasuri Nanami is my number one waifu, if only because she would horribly murder all the others if they didn't shut up and toe the line.
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RE: 2020, the election campaigns have begun
#10
Maybe, maybe. I remain concerned about his potential to divide the democrats again with the 'Well I'll vote Trump or not vote just to teach them a lesson' pack of idiots. Also, he's older again and that brings another set of issues.
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RE: 2020, the election campaigns have begun
#11
He's also not the only progressive who's announced an intention to run... and some of the other progressives are not old, white, or male.
--
Rob Kelk

"Governments have no right to question the loyalty of those who oppose them. Adversaries remain citizens of the same state, common subjects of the same sovereign, servants of the same law."
- Michael Ignatieff, addressing Stanford University in 2012


"Dont let anyone think for you; most people can barely think for themselves."
-
Rare Earth, "The Giants You Can't See from the Ground"
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RE: 2020, the election campaigns have begun
#12
Should I sell my 2016 surplus Bernie merch now for a profit, or hodl hodl hodl?
--∇×v⃑
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RE: 2020, the election campaigns have begun
#13
Here's something interesting from around me. The New Jersey State Senate has just passed a bill requiring the disclosure of a Presidential candidate's last five years' tax returns before he is allowed on the ballot. If the other house, the Assembly, approves it and the governor signs it, it will keep Trump completely off the ballot in NJ (and far away from its 14 electoral votes) if he still insists on hiding his financial history.

This isn't the first time such a bill has come up; in 2017 a virtually identical bill made it to the governor's desk. But the governor at the time, Chris Christie, was a Republican and Trump supporter, and he vetoed it. The current governor, Murphy, is a Democrat. If it gets through the Assembly (not unlikely) and Murphy signs it, NJ will be the first state (of about 30 with such laws in progress) to require tax return disclosure from Presidential candidates.

Bill would keep Trump off 2020 NJ ballot unless he releases his tax returns
-- Bob

I have been Roland, Beowulf, Achilles, Gilgamesh, Clark Kent, Mary Sue, DJ Croft, Skysaber.  I have been 
called a hundred names and will be called a thousand more before the sun grows dim and cold....

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RE: 2020, the election campaigns have begun
#14
[Image: trump-tweet-video.jpg]

Source

Apparently Trump either didn't bother to try licensing the music, or can't afford to. And we all know what he says his net worth is.

So, does this mean we should expect to see an update to copyright laws come down the pike, or is this yet another case of Republicans thinking laws don't apply to them?
--
Rob Kelk

"Governments have no right to question the loyalty of those who oppose them. Adversaries remain citizens of the same state, common subjects of the same sovereign, servants of the same law."
- Michael Ignatieff, addressing Stanford University in 2012


"Dont let anyone think for you; most people can barely think for themselves."
-
Rare Earth, "The Giants You Can't See from the Ground"
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RE: 2020, the election campaigns have begun
#15
It's not just the Republicans that think all music is open source. Most politicians think that, it's just that the Republican party tends to be and have a more odious platform that the copyright holders of the music object to on various grounds.

And, well, copyright is copyright. You either pay for the license or you don't use it.
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RE: 2020, the election campaigns have begun
#16
Years later and I'm still amused and boggled by Trump deciding that The Who's Won't Get Fooled Again was a good theme for his victory party. I mean, he's probably stupi enough not to get most of the more subtle lyrics, but "a parting on the left is now a parting on the right, and the beards have all grown longer overnight" and "in with the new boss, same as the old boss?" I'm just hoping he doesn't manage to fool enough Americans again to get a second term.

Oh, I know the perfect music for that campaign, though! After all, he's a man of wealth and taste, right? Big Grin
--
‎noli esse culus
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RE: 2020, the election campaigns have begun
#17
A lot of people would argue the wealth and taste part. Especially his tastes. It's almost an insult to Lucifer to attempt to compare Trump to him in that regard.
Yasuri Nanami is my number one waifu, if only because she would horribly murder all the others if they didn't shut up and toe the line.
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RE: 2020, the election campaigns have begun
#18
Hm, well, maybe a nice dramatic piano piece instead then?
--
‎noli esse culus
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RE: 2020, the election campaigns have begun
#19
No more Biden his time.

Joe Biden's tossed his hat into the ring. So far, his platform is that he isn't Trump.
--
Rob Kelk

"Governments have no right to question the loyalty of those who oppose them. Adversaries remain citizens of the same state, common subjects of the same sovereign, servants of the same law."
- Michael Ignatieff, addressing Stanford University in 2012


"Dont let anyone think for you; most people can barely think for themselves."
-
Rare Earth, "The Giants You Can't See from the Ground"
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RE: 2020, the election campaigns have begun
#20
(04-25-2019, 07:52 AM)robkelk Wrote: No more Biden his time.

Joe Biden's tossed his hat into the ring. So far, his platform is that he isn't Trump.

I feel Biden's too old.  And I say this as almost certainly the oldest old fart on this forum.  However, not being Trump or anyone who approves of Trump needs to be a fundamental plank in anyone's platform.  Trump and all his works and ways — and all his bigoted, willfully ignorant followers — need to be rejected if the soul of the United States is ever to be redeemed.  

Even if Trump loses in such an utter landslide that not even his StormTrumpers will rally to shield him from being put out of the White House once the new president is sworn in, it'll be decades before the U.S. is trusted again ... and I doubt I'll live long enough to see it.  We'll be feared, for our weapons and for the enormous resources we misuse.  We won't be respected.  

I comfort myself with the reminder that Germany eventually recovered (mostly) from the shadow of their embrace of evil.

-----
"Oh, my people had many gods. There was Conformity, and Authority, and Expense Account, and Opinion. And there was Status, whose symbols were many, and who rode in the great chariot Cadillac, which was almost a god itself. And there was Atombomb, the dread destroyer, who would some day come to end the world." — Lord Kalvan of Otherwhen, H. Beam Piper
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RE: 2020, the election campaigns have begun
#21
Germany recovered with great difficulty and by repeatedly condemning the evils they committed while at least attempting to be better.

The USA... does not have the impetus for that. And certainly not sincerely, the USA's racism and arrogance are rarely as naked as they are now, but they've certainly been an undercurrent for a long time.
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RE: 2020, the election campaigns have begun
#22
I didn't mean we're guaranteed to recover, and I regret if I gave the impression that I thought so.  I meant we've got a chance, even though it's not a good one, and I repeat, I don't expect I'll live to see the U.S. people's redemption.
-----
"The Lady of the Lake, her arm clad in the purest shimmering samite, held aloft Excalibur from the bosom of the water, signifying by divine providence that this was some killer weed."
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RE: 2020, the election campaigns have begun
#23
(04-25-2019, 08:14 AM)DHBirr Wrote: I feel Biden's too old.  And I say this as almost certainly the oldest old fart on this forum.

Well, if he was to be elected, he'd be the oldest President ever.

Despite that, he's already a front-runner - just because he's Biden. The other candidates need to get their messages out, loudly, and keep getting their messages out.

Similarly, anybody in the GOP who wants to try grabbing the brass ring had better start making noises in the back rooms, away from Trump's ears... assuming they haven't already.
--
Rob Kelk

"Governments have no right to question the loyalty of those who oppose them. Adversaries remain citizens of the same state, common subjects of the same sovereign, servants of the same law."
- Michael Ignatieff, addressing Stanford University in 2012


"Dont let anyone think for you; most people can barely think for themselves."
-
Rare Earth, "The Giants You Can't See from the Ground"
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RE: 2020, the election campaigns have begun
#24
The Republicans are kinda caught between a rock and a hard place, methinks.

Even if there is not enough evidence to prove collusion in the Mueller Report, there's still some pretty damning stuff in there - damning enough that Barr felt he had to redact more than half of the report in order to protect Trump and his administration.

We're not digging into the personal details of his life, here.  We're looking specifically at who paid who for what and why, with a possible side-order of "What is he trying to hide in his tax returns?"  Al Capone got nailed  for tax evasion when nothing else stuck.  There's no reason why Trump can't be impeached and then charged for it.

That said, if the Republicans wish to remain in power, they need to start fielding candidates now.  The reason is simple: while they have the power indeed to keep Trump from being impeached, doing so will turn a lot of their constituents against them.  Because, I think a lot of Conservative voters out there are doing the conservative thing and waiting to see what really shakes out from the Mueller Report.

It's going to be at a point close to election time that the Democrats will make their move.  And it couldn't come at a worse time.  The Republicans have a whopping 21 seats up for election in 2020, versus the Democrats 12 seats.

Even worse is that the deck is already stacked against the Republicans - two of those seats are toss-ups, with another three only 'leaning' or 'tilting' towards the Republican side.  The Democrats, on the other hand, are mostly on pretty solid ground, with only one seat being likely to flip.

If the Democrats do come up with considerable and compelling evidence for an impeachment hearing and the Republican controlled Senate arbitrarily votes it down, then they do so at great peril.

They WILL lose the Senate, and they will very likely lose the Presidency.
Yasuri Nanami is my number one waifu, if only because she would horribly murder all the others if they didn't shut up and toe the line.
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RE: 2020, the election campaigns have begun
#25
So by the time Biden got in the race, I was completely uninterested in what he had to say. Maybe that was the plan all along.

But let's talk about Republican challenger Bill Weld for a minute. He ran last time on the Libertarian ticket as Gary Johnson's VP. But I can remember I had this thought back in 2016: This guy sounds sane and electable, so of course the Libertarians would pick the other guy to lead their ticket who talks about how much dope he smokes. It was a clearly wrong choice. But Bill Weld man, well liked Republican former governor of Massachusetts, talks about the deficit and national security, sounds like a Reagan era Republican, and actually knows how to talk about issues. Seriously, if you're a conservative, give him a look.
--∇×v⃑
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