A Question About BGC Fics...

[Black Aeronaut]

I've been wanting to do some writing on Bubblegum Crisis, but one thing that I've been having hang-ups with would be the tricky act of blending the OVA
and the TV Series together into a single timeline of events. So, I wonder if anyone else out there has done anything similar and what good and bad examples
there are. Can anyone help me out in that respect?

[CattyNebulart]

I don't think they can be blended together, BGC2032 and BGC2040 are very different series with little overlap. Sure many of the character names are the
same, but they don't act the same, the organizations they work for are also very different. and one is set in 2032 and one in 2040. They don't share
any continuity whatsoever.
E: "Did they... did they just endorse the combination of the JSDF and US Army by showing them as two lesbian lolicons moving in together and holding hands and talking about how 'intimate' they were?"
B: "Have you forgotten so soon? They're phasing out Don't Ask, Don't Tell."

[robkelk]

BGC 2040 is not related to the original BGC.
BGC 2040 was never intended to be related to the original BGC.

Different timeframe.
Different storyline.
Different background stories.
Different character attitudes.
Different designs.
Different music.
Different Universe.

About the only thing that's the same are character names, and that the Knight Sabers, the AD Police, and Genom are all in the city of Tokyo (which also has a different name depending on series)

Of course, it looks like the AD Police of the ADP TV series is not any more related to the ADP of 2040 than it is to the ADP of classic BGC/BGCrash/ADP. That is to say, it ain't. Yet another alternate universe.

Think of it like Tenchi or Patlabor. All those series, with apparently the same characters, but the series have nothing to do with each other because they're all set in different universes.

Better yet, think of it like Dirty Pair vs Dirty Pair Flash. Both feature characters named Kei and Yuri who work for WWWA, but that's where any resemblance ends. Different universes.

So sayeth Jeanne Hedge, back in August 1999. And she was kind enough to let me add that to the BGC FAQ I maintain, too...
--
Rob Kelk
"Governments have no right to question the loyalty of those who oppose
them. Adversaries remain citizens of the same state, common subjects of
the same sovereign, servants of the same law."

- Michael Ignatieff, addressing Stanford University in 2012

[Bob Schroeck]

You'll really have to decide to pick one as your base, and then leaven it with the bits you like from the other. See EPU's The Iron Age for an example of pick-and-choose like that.
-- Bob
---------
Then the horns kicked in...
...and my shoes began to squeak.

[Black Aeronaut]

It does seem so. Perhaps then I should... rethink how I go about this. The point is that there are events, characters, and plot devices from both that I think
are absolutely nifty beyond compare. Therefore, what I would like to do is create a timeline that, like the 2040 and the 2032 series, is an entirely seperate
universe unto itself - it will just borrow a lot from either side of the fence. For one thing, I think Largo serving as an 'underling' for Galatea
-works-. And some of the adventures of the Knight Sabers from the 2032 series would make for great side-stories along the way. I think that having those
subplots going on with the strange happenings at GENOM in the background would give it all the more edge (not angst, mind you). You know, despite the impending
sense of doom, life is still going on in that Murphy's Law kinda way.

EDIT: BTW, robkelk, thanks for that link to your most informative FAQ. It's gonna be a big help in picking and choosing what I want from either side.

[Bob Schroeck]

Rob, you didn't point him at the April Fool's edition, did you?
-- Bob
---------
Then the horns kicked in...
...and my shoes began to squeak.

[robkelk]

I really should dig up the April Fools' Edition... but here's a highlight from it.

"What are the Rules of the Knight Sabers?

Rule One: No Boomers!

Rule Two, no member of the team is to tease Mackie by making sexual innuendoes at all -- if Sylia's watching.

Rule Three? No Boomers!

Rule Four, now this season, I don't want to catch anybody not going solo.

Rule Five... No Boomers!

Rule Six, there is NO ... Rule Six.

Rule Seven, (Everyone!) No Boomers!

Right, that concludes the readin' of the rules, Priss."
--
Rob Kelk
"Governments have no right to question the loyalty of those who oppose
them. Adversaries remain citizens of the same state, common subjects of
the same sovereign, servants of the same law."

- Michael Ignatieff, addressing Stanford University in 2012

[Necratoid]

One of the biggest differences between the series for me was the music. The original had good music. Memorable music, music you could enjoy on the radio.
2040 Priss should have been beaten to death for torturing me. That *liteny of explitives deleted* awful TWANG rift that came up EVERY eye catch interlude made
me want to stop watching and for 2/3s of the story. Even as the episodes got better and better the TWANG made me recoil and block its memory over and over
again, until I just stopped regeristering it altogether. Which scared me and my brother who apparently blocked it at the same rate. Personally, I think
someone was drugging the water supply or one of the boomers/random passerby would have assassinated that Priss for noise pollution.

Anyway, about Largo... no. I can't see him as excepting himself as an underling of anyone/anything. He has a suped up version version of a tyrannical
corporate climber as the basis for his ego... having him honestly subservient just wouldn't be quite incharacter... now being the Starscream (generation 1)
to Galatea's Megatron I can see. Technically loyalish, but always looking for a way to get that one step higher.

Another, and majorly relivant, difference is that the two universes use substantially different basises for their boomer technology. 2032 had organic parts as
a control system for the boomers with mechanical parts... 2040 had basically fusion boomers as the basis for all boomer tech... which wwas how they went all
mutating youma in the first place... this is also rather relevant in the designs of the hardsuits.

[Black Aeronaut]

On Largo...

No, I don't really see him as being subservient to Galatea, except as something more of an equal. Largo, from what I saw, sought revolution for the
boomers. So, in a sense, did Galatea. The fact that Galatea happens to be able to command all boomers by virtue of being their 'momma' just gives her
something to use against Largo as leverage.

On Boomer-tech...

I always thought that boomers were like an artificial living organism. Like some kind of silicon based life form. In both series, we see boomers assimilating
bits and pieces of whatever's around them into their body (That episode with the killer satelite's control unit in 2032 especially). While there's
going to be an issue with the cores, I think I can work around that. For one, I had a wonderful idea that 33/S units from 2032 could be made by infusing
boomer-tech into test-tube fetuses. Hence their remarkable human-like responses, yet boomer-esque abilities and resilience.

[Necratoid]

Except that at some point I remember the 2032 series also had a little black box callled the overmind system that did the ccntrol all boomers thing. Largo just
didn't get that thing, so he had the SOL. I haven't watched it in a while so I may be remembering something from a fanfic... but I don't think I
am.

Largo also isn't just any boomer... he is the boomer reincarnation of the power mad Genom executive Brian J. Mason. Done with an artifical body and a
slightly warped mind scan copy thing. BJM had a god complex... in Largo he felt he had obtained a proper body worthy of that status. BJM would have sold out
his mom for a pitance... somehow I can't picture him seeing Galatea as anything but a less god, a tool of himself, and one he'd rather have the powers
of than have exist. On the otherhand if she is treating him as a pawn he'll flip out... he may be a prisoner in his own body, but first change he gets
he'll off her and steal her power from her corpse. There would have to be a major reason that BJM wanted Galatea as a mate if they are to interact in a
different way and I seem to recall Galatea having a child's body. I'm also not sure he'd be all that intrested in a Stingray as screwed up as the
one in 2040.

Boomer minds in 2032 are as far as I know carbon based. I've never seen anything to say the living bits that make them cyborgs aren't carbon based... I
remember them being called organic before. Organic things have to be carbon based... its the literal definition. Yes, silicon chips are involved, but that is
the machine part of them.

In 2032, fusion parts are war material and terror weapons. The one in Aqua city should show how dangerous they are. They are also rare parts. As long as they
have power and material to absorb they can get ginormous.

In 2040, every boomer has the potential to be a fusion boomer. Its why they grow and mutate like some kind of youma while they atttack. They also appear to
have heavily restrained minds... for instance, when the controls where obliterated at the end point and the boomers went wild.... the watress boomer flipped
out and started forcefeeding her owner/boss coffee while ranting madly about how much she HATED serving cofffee and how she really, really needed to do
something else. Leon looked at the scene and left to deal with the rest of the city... he basically decided that was a normal waitress snapping deal and moved
on without stopping it. I remember the owner complaining about how she kept breaking down for no apparent reason earilier on, apparenlt she wasn't able to
tell him directly and he couldn't take a hint. I think the nanotech fusion thing was just the controls being taken off the growth process from
manufacturing them in vats. The Boomers with the restrains removed by outside forces are picking low mind, inexperienced boomers that aren't smart enough
to be stable... or insane under the restrains like the one that was forced to lick that guys boots.

In 2032, the only 'rogue boomers' in the series are Largo, the 33S' (the assassin type that killed Irene was a custom varient of that) and maybe
ADAMA count as one. All the others are programmed to go rogue under Genom's development plans and for assassinations and terror. They are also assembly
line models... they show them make them in factories in the episode with the super boomer with the SOL.

(Edit for spellcheck reasons.)

[Evil Midnight Lurker]

Largo isn't only Brian Mason. The ADPolice manga strongly implies that his god complex is a result of his
uploaded personality having accidentally fused with that of the boomer Armstrong V7-28, a crazed workerbot with a messiah complex who'd escaped Genom's
custody and had been harassing Mason from within the GENOM mainframe. Armstrong had a fanatic's vision but no real ability to back it up, Mason had a good
head for strategy but no real goals beside his own aggrandizement; blend 'em together and you have someone who's genuinely dangerous...

--Sam

"Guilty! GUILTY! And all who oppose me shall suffer like legless sled dogs!"

[Black Aeronaut]

Well, there would still be Galatea literally keeping a figurative leash on him - Largo would absolutely despise her, what she stands for, and how she has
imprisoned his will, but in the end she ultimately has power over him ans she sees him as a very useful tool for combating the Knight Sabers.

Also Necratoid, she doesn't remain as a little girl for very long. She does this instant grow-up thing somewhere along the way and turns her hair black and
her eyes green - a dark reflection of Sylia. Though personally I think it would have been just as creepy to see a boomer-Sylia in the original colors running
around with God-boomer powers.

EM, I never knew about Armstrong. I'll have to do more research on this character to learn more about him. Now that this has been pointed out, the
Largo-Mason relationship makes a lot more sense than it did before.

[OpMegs]

Month and a week old post, but I thought this might still be worthwhile if you're looking into the Mason/Largo dynamic: http://www.ravensgarage.com/garage/maslargo.htm

Also, various points that I'm aware of that seem relevant:

- 2040's Brian J. Mason is turned into a boomerized "gargoyle" near the end of the series, so that he can witness the world Galatea's about
to create. He is not KILLED, and had Bubblegum Crisis 2041 actually been made, the director noted that was a plot point that would've carried over,
suggesting a sort of Neo-Largo.

- Largo has an obsession with Sylia he inherited from Mason, and Galatea is a perfect replica of Sylia(her final appearance looks very much like a long haired
2032 Sylia, with her black hair) named after a living doll crafted by a man who wanted the perfect wife. Perhaps instead of Galatea subjecting Largo, Largo
might be looking to create an equal "goddess" for one of such high standing as himself.

- Galatea's motivations aren't so malevolent as they appear. She objects to GENOM's (willing) enslavement of her people(by explanation of the
limiters on their intelligence, powers, etc), and the final episode seem to indicate that she realizes that, by attempting to destroy humanity in turn so as to
free her children, she's become as bad as GENOM ever was. Largo, by contrast, has a god complex about boomers and wants to rule over them whether it's
for their own good or not(he has no compunction about throwing Sylvie and Anri away without a second thought, or slaughtering multiple boomer guards in Red
Eyes). It's not so much that his rulership will be good for them as it is he deserves to be worshipped for his magnificence, and the boomers are easier to
make his subjects than humans would be(and possibly a bit of racism, given Mason apparently regarded a boomer body as inherently superior to a human one.)
---
"Oh, silver blade, forged in the depths of the beyond. Heed my summons and purge those who stand in my way. Lay
waste."

[Black Aeronaut]

Thanks for the info, Ops. It puts a rather interesting idea in my head, a reversal of what I originally had in mind: Largo awakens Galatea seeking that Goddess
you mentioned to stand by his side, and of course she does so because she wants to see that Boomers are free. At first, anyways. She later sees just how
murderously narcissistic he is, and begins to form a Magnificent Bastard-ish plot of her own to take him down with the help of the Knight Sabers.

I've been busy working on other projects as well as this one, and I've been busy as well. It's tough having so much to do when you're as
easily distracted as me. ^_^;;

Anyhow, expect more stuff for Fenspace in the near future, while this goes onto a back burner until my partner in crime decides to show up again.